Dive into the world of corporate insurance innovation with as Dan White, Managing Partner at Ninety moderates this panel discussion with Steven Zuanella, Group Chief Digital & Innovation Officer at Generali, and Stefaan de Kezel, Director – Innovation at Baloise Insurance. Discover how best to build an innovation operating model.

Transcript

0:01

[Music]

0:07

hello and welcome to insure tech connect

0:10

my name is dan white and joined by two

0:13

illustrious innovators from the world of

0:15

corporate insurance innovation um can i

0:18

ask you guys to just introduce

0:19

yourselves briefly i’ll explain then

0:21

what we’re going to be covering off

0:22

today and why i’ve asked the two of you

0:25

to come and speak with me about this

0:26

stephen could i start with you

0:28

yes good morning good afternoon good

0:30

evening everybody it’s great to be here

0:31

on the panel with you dan uh so my

0:33

name’s steven zuanella i’m currently the

0:35

group chief digital officer for general

0:38

ali um and previously i was scripture

0:40

digital officer for rsa and zurich um

0:43

and working for barclays and prudential

0:45

so broad experience across financial

0:46

services and my roommate today uh and in

0:49

the last uh year and a half with gen ed

0:51

alley has been to drive digital

0:53

transformation and most importantly

0:54

innovation right across our organization

0:56

great to be here thank you stephen

0:59

and stefan

1:01

yeah great to be on the panel as well

1:03

dan and steven so thank you for inviting

1:05

me

1:06

i work as the director of innovation and

1:07

business development for a group called

1:09

ahia so that’s an insurer active boat in

1:11

europe and in asia and my role is

1:14

actually a group rule for innovation

1:16

where we try to accelerate what is

1:18

happening locally and try to facilitate

1:20

innovation within our countries

1:23

thank you stefano thank you both for

1:25

being with us today and for for giving

1:28

your time to engage with this

1:29

conversation um so my name is dan white

1:32

i’m managing partner at 90 we’re an

1:34

innovation focused consultancy

1:36

specializing in the uh insurance sector

1:39

um stephen for instance has been a

1:41

client for a long time and i’ve known

1:42

stefan for a number of years and the

1:45

that’s why i’ve asked them both to to

1:47

engage on this panel because i know

1:48

they’ve both got well-formed and very

1:51

experienced views on the question of how

1:53

do you best

1:54

build an innovation engine or mechanism

1:57

or operating model within a large scaled

2:00

insurance business both of them are paid

2:02

to do that both of them have done that a

2:04

number of times

2:05

and

2:06

both of them have engaged with me very

2:08

helpfully over the last year on a piece

2:10

of research that we’ve carried out

2:12

um

2:13

uh published on our site90.com called

2:16

the blueprint

2:17

which is where we’ve looked at the

2:19

question of how do the world’s top 250

2:21

carriers do innovation what’s working

2:23

well for them what’s not working so well

2:25

for them and it’s that set of questions

2:27

that i really wanted to

2:29

to dig into today

2:31

um so let me just start if i may guys

2:33

with a

2:34

uh one of the the findings in that piece

2:36

of research which was that innovation

2:39

seldom seems to be a static thing

2:42

it seems to to ebb and flow um i call it

2:45

the roller coaster a model where

2:48

one year everyone within a particular

2:50

insurer is is really investing into

2:52

innovation really believes in it really

2:54

um perceives it to be the big thing

2:57

and uh and everyone backs it heavily

3:00

a year or two later question marks are

3:02

starting to arise and then

3:04

the the slippery slope of the the down

3:06

slope of that roller coaster kicks in

3:08

and we start dismantling and

3:10

disregarding uh sorry of discarding uh

3:13

what we’ve just built and that that

3:15

cycle seems to repeat itself time and

3:18

time again

3:19

and so i’m just curious as to your views

3:21

and maybe stefan if i could start with

3:23

you why does innovation

3:25

why do innovation mechanisms so often

3:28

seem to come unstuck and fail

3:30

within an insurance business

3:33

well i’m not sure if it’s certainly in

3:34

the insurance business but but i compare

3:36

it a bit to what i would call an iceberg

3:39

where actually there’s innovation all

3:41

the time in in most of the business but

3:43

most of that is what we would call

3:45

incremental innovation

3:47

and that is what i would call below the

3:49

water line so you don’t usually see it

3:51

people don’t tend to brag about it but

3:53

it’s highly useful and tends to create a

3:55

lot of value for uh most of the

3:57

businesses now what people tend to see

3:59

however is what happens above the

4:01

waterline so that part of the iceberg

4:03

but those tend to be driven by whatever

4:05

is happening in the environment and so

4:07

those projects tend to be more ad hoc or

4:11

driven by certain events

4:13

of course usually also are more prone to

4:15

failure because typically they tend to

4:17

be a bit less close to the business that

4:19

that we’re in

4:20

and therefore they attract more

4:22

attention but also when they fail or

4:24

when they don’t go as planned or when

4:26

simply circumstances

4:28

change people start doing different

4:30

things and this is why i think you

4:32

sort of see this kind of innovation

4:34

mechanisms adapting to whatever is

4:36

happening in in the environment and so

4:38

you’re looking at what’s happening at

4:40

the top but the the bottom part which is

4:42

what most of the innovation at least for

4:44

me is about that for me is fairly stable

4:46

it’s more the part that sits on top

4:48

where indeed it tends to change and

4:50

fluctuate quite a bit

4:52

the innovation theater yeah interesting

4:54

and stephen what’s your what’s your

4:56

sense of this

4:57

so look i think for me

4:59

innovation has been around since as long

5:01

as i’ve been around and way before us so

5:03

this isn’t a new concept the big

5:05

challenge for us is how do you do it

5:07

successfully in corporates and

5:09

particularly in my case in large global

5:11

corporates when you have different

5:13

cultures and different uh ways of

5:15

working right across the piece now we

5:16

define genetic innovation at genet alley

5:19

as a very broad concept

5:21

where we want people to to make

5:23

improvements whether it’s day-to-day

5:24

improvements or whether it’s step change

5:27

improvements and new propositions so we

5:29

cover a broad spectrum of of innovation

5:31

activities um and i think you know the

5:34

the the amount of innovation going on

5:36

within any company including generali is

5:38

actually pretty significant we’re just

5:40

not able to see all of it at the same

5:42

time so i’m a big believer that

5:44

innovation happens whether we want to

5:46

facilitate it or not

5:48

what we can do is is to make a real

5:50

difference and translate the the energy

5:53

on innovation into processes and

5:56

solutions that can actually have an

5:57

impact over the short medium and long

5:59

term for our customers for our people

6:01

and ultimately for our shareholders and

6:03

so i’m a big believer in it there’s no

6:05

silver bullet unfortunately which is why

6:07

we’re still talking about this after a

6:09

number of years um but there are plenty

6:11

of models i’m sure we’ll get into them

6:13

in terms of how we can see success and

6:15

how we can encourage success and avoid

6:17

some of the failures of the past uh and

6:19

of today

6:21

yeah i think that’s um

6:23

it occurs to me and i think

6:25

we’ve seen this and we’ve talked about

6:26

it before that uh

6:29

quite often that failure is linked to a

6:31

failure to scale

6:32

when uh when when the onlookers

6:34

particularly the cfo is looking at the

6:37

spend in in that top layer of the

6:39

iceberg above the the water lines to

6:42

find

6:43

they’re looking for outcome they’re

6:44

looking for scale success they’re

6:46

looking for a bottom line return and

6:47

when that scale does not happen

6:51

what is the point right and so that that

6:53

top line gets gets a haircut

6:56

which leads me to a question i guess

6:57

you’re both looking after innovation in

6:59

large international groups where in

7:02

those groups is innovation best done and

7:05

so stephan i take your pointer out about

7:07

it that below the water line

7:10

that the bulk of of that tactical

7:12

horizon one type innovation is happening

7:14

anyway

7:16

that stuff that’s a little bit more

7:17

nebulous a little bit more risky where

7:19

is that best placed within a large group

7:22

insurance business

7:23

well for us it’s best placed locally um

7:27

and and so close actually to the market

7:29

because initially

7:31

we we assume at least that this is

7:33

driven by whatever the market is

7:34

demanding or the customers are

7:36

demanding so it’s only logical that it

7:38

would sit close um to where that

7:40

business is sitting which is

7:42

local and not global the role of global

7:46

in that is for us this is slightly

7:47

different there it’s more that we can

7:50

bring concepts or developments that have

7:51

been made in one market you can

7:53

transport them to other markets and so

7:55

you can go faster in those markets but

7:58

again context is really important we’ve

7:59

seen cases where things can be adopted

8:02

fairly easily and the other way around

8:04

where you something that works really

8:05

well in one market and you bring it to

8:07

another market and you see there’s

8:08

virtually

8:10

no

8:10

interest i think you shared with me um a

8:13

couple of tips from from your experience

8:15

about things that are easier to scale

8:18

from one market to the other in that

8:20

group context and from memory one was

8:22

things that are more back office

8:24

type innovations rather than

8:26

propositional ones

8:27

and the second thing that i think you

8:28

told me you found had scaled more easily

8:30

was things that were external forms of

8:32

innovation rather than

8:34

ideas born inside is that right

8:38

that is correct indeed the the the more

8:40

back office ones or let’s say

8:42

operational improvement ones you could

8:44

call them as well they tend to have uh

8:46

the attention immediately of the

8:47

business people um because the uh the

8:50

benefits emerge much faster and usually

8:53

then there’s also some similarity

8:55

in what you’re looking at a claims

8:57

process in one country looks fairly

8:59

similar usually to a claims process in

9:01

another country

9:03

so that tends to work well

9:05

external ids tend to have their benefits

9:07

as well depending on of course what is

9:10

the the nature that you’re looking at

9:12

because that depends largely also on

9:14

what countries are currently investing

9:16

in or looking in

9:17

you might have something really smart

9:19

about uh just say telematics in one

9:21

country but if in another country

9:23

telematics is not a topic at all there’s

9:25

very little point in bringing that to

9:26

the other market

9:29

stephen how does that how does that play

9:31

out across generali in terms of where

9:33

innovation is sitting and being driven

9:35

and most naturally feeling comfortable

9:37

so it’s a little bit like stefan

9:40

we we tend to uh to split some of the

9:43

innovation activity um

9:46

so we we obviously prefer local

9:48

innovation activity where that’s closest

9:49

to the customer uh and that can be most

9:52

efficient and effective there but i

9:53

guess slightly differently to to rjs

9:56

maybe um that we are we have also a

9:58

central innovation function

10:00

and what we would like to do and what we

10:02

are doing is where there are ideas that

10:05

are not particularly attached to a

10:06

specific marketplace so probably some of

10:08

the horizon 3 ideas that are more out

10:10

there um that need some capability that

10:13

is and skill sets that the businesses

10:15

don’t always have then we think that’s

10:17

best led either in the center or so on a

10:19

different group from from away from the

10:21

market coalface where they face the

10:23

day-to-day pressures of getting the

10:24

short-term results and given that we

10:26

cover 55 countries globally there’s a

10:29

huge diversity of capability within

10:31

those markets so for us a generality

10:33

it’s a mix of local innovation where we

10:36

possibly can and we support that from

10:38

the group in terms of uh funding and

10:40

we’ll talk about that later and also

10:41

some capability and then where we think

10:44

we should step outside the box and be

10:46

slightly more risky and slightly taking

10:47

away from the short-term view well we

10:50

think that should be done more towards

10:51

the center

10:53

so that’s the model that we saw quite a

10:54

lot in in the research uh that i

10:56

referred to is that that higher risk

11:00

more nebulous

11:01

um forms of innovation happening at the

11:03

center because no one else is gonna have

11:06

that within their um their annual

11:08

targets

11:09

but does that not require stephen a a

11:11

level of patience and commitment from

11:14

therefore the group exec type

11:16

of person that’s going to understand

11:19

that these ideas are potentially going

11:21

to take three to five years to start to

11:23

mature and to to demonstrate some return

11:26

yes it is and um you know are you if

11:29

you’re asking whether my board is

11:30

patient uh by the the answer to that is

11:33

is no because like any other board they

11:36

want results um and so uh i think what

11:39

specifically now they were in this

11:40

crisis um the health crisis and the

11:43

economic crisis is putting more pressure

11:45

on the on the short term uh i guess

11:48

performance of the business uh but i

11:50

think it’s our job and and so far we’ve

11:52

managed to do it in general

11:54

to tell to tell the business that

11:56

there’s a balance between some of the

11:58

short-term um incremental improvements

12:00

we can make through innovation and some

12:02

of the longer-term bets that we’re going

12:04

to have to take a little bit more risk

12:06

over a little bit more time over and

12:08

actually wait to see the results and

12:09

actually i think we’ve got that balance

12:12

i think about right at the moment but it

12:14

also requires for us to be able to tell

12:17

a story that is compelling to the board

12:20

telling them why it’s important to do

12:22

this because of course nobody wants to

12:23

sit here and say i’ll give you a 10-year

12:25

return maybe

12:27

what we want to be able to say is we

12:29

need to do this this is exactly the

12:30

rationale why we need to do it these are

12:33

the threats that we’re facing these are

12:34

the opportunities that we might be able

12:35

to embark upon unless we do innovate and

12:38

take some risk we’re never going to take

12:40

advantage of that and of course it’ll be

12:41

a balance in some cases we will fail and

12:44

that’s not a bad thing uh as long as

12:46

it’s not every time and in some cases

12:48

we’ll succeed and when we succeed it’ll

12:49

make up for the failures so it’s a

12:51

balance of that discourse i guess with

12:54

the with the patients of our exco uh

12:57

trying to show them that there is a

12:58

long-term view here that can be proven

13:00

and that can give us results but it’s an

13:02

ongoing discussion it’s constantly

13:04

changing

13:05

and this crisis of course has brought

13:06

that to our head right now too

13:09

yeah i think for me this um this speaks

13:12

to prioritization what are we

13:14

prioritizing as innovation activities

13:16

how do we select the ideas in our

13:18

innovation portfolio and one of the

13:20

things that’s that i see as i speak to

13:23

people around the market is that

13:25

um scarcity has become the the driving

13:28

force right as everyone has kind of

13:30

wound back as investment returns have

13:32

dipped significantly um people are

13:34

making these these investment decisions

13:36

from a position of scarcity and i’ve

13:39

always been a big believer actually that

13:41

scarcity drives really good decision

13:42

making when you’ve got less money

13:44

you’re much more picky about what you

13:46

back and so some of the ideas which are

13:48

really getting a lot of traction a lot

13:50

of investment right now are ideas which

13:52

maybe a year ago were optional and

13:54

they’ve become table stakes stefan is

13:56

that some

13:58

that kind of selection process around

14:00

ideas

14:01

how’s that playing out for you and at

14:03

the gs

14:05

this is again mainly something that

14:07

happens at local level um at group level

14:10

uh it’s slightly different in the sense

14:12

that we have a close monitoring in need

14:14

of what is happening around us so the

14:16

trends that we see

14:18

emerging and what we then need to do to

14:21

respond to those trends and so what we

14:22

did see was a number of areas that we’ve

14:24

selected which have become more

14:27

prominent and what we then typically

14:28

tend to do is gather a number of people

14:30

from various opcos to work uh on on

14:33

those specific topics but ultimately the

14:35

way that they’re then implemented or

14:37

what is actually done with them that’s

14:39

always something that happens locally so

14:41

you need a market that’s basically you

14:43

need a market where you want to go and

14:44

test out some of that stuff you can’t do

14:46

that at a group level where you don’t

14:49

necessarily have a market or customers

14:51

or any of these things but people

14:52

together do that and yes there are a

14:55

number of trends that have become more

14:56

prominent actually and you call it

14:58

scarcity but sometimes it’s it’s uh what

15:01

i would call now choices become

15:02

self-evident because of the market

15:04

simply putting you in front of a number

15:06

of things that have evolved much faster

15:08

that were on your or your radar or

15:10

whatever you were using to look at

15:12

what’s happening but they’ve now become

15:14

at the forefront simply because of what

15:16

happened around you and that actually

15:17

makes choosing easier

15:21

yeah and um

15:23

stephen you mentioned funding earlier

15:26

um

15:27

so

15:28

funding and scarcity and that kind of

15:30

self-evidence

15:31

selection of ideas i rather review

15:33

funding local ideas from the center

15:37

so let me let me just say a quick word

15:39

on on scarcity then i’ll answer the

15:41

question on funding

15:43

i don’t know what i don’t know what it’s

15:44

like at 90 if you have unlimited budgets

15:46

for everything but scarcity is a concept

15:48

we’ve always had to live with it’s not a

15:50

new thing um and so actually that forces

15:53

us always to make decisions around

15:54

prioritization and i guess what’s

15:56

happened now with the with the uh the

15:58

economic and health crisis is that we’ve

16:00

had a new dimension come in very quickly

16:03

very hard that’s forced us to make

16:05

alternative decisions so some of the

16:06

areas that we were focusing already on

16:09

that we’re focusing even more now are

16:11

things like remote working so hence this

16:13

conference being done virtually rather

16:14

than face to face that’s gone from 90 in

16:17

the office to 90 percent at home

16:19

literally overnight

16:21

if we look at some of our sales

16:23

capabilities that within generally

16:25

across our different countries you know

16:27

it’s critical that we’re able to sell

16:28

remotely now to everybody because

16:30

clearly people can’t see people and so

16:32

we put a lot of focus on that and with

16:33

that comes a security

16:35

and the uh and the uh the protection for

16:38

customers and for the company as well

16:39

that needs to go with that in a virtual

16:41

space in terms of your question around

16:43

funding yes we do co-fund um uh what we

16:47

would suggest are good ideas from our

16:49

businesses we want to encourage them to

16:51

take risk we want to encourage them to

16:53

step out of their day-to-day

16:55

routine and to develop new propositions

16:57

for customers or new technologies for

16:59

our brokers for example our agents or

17:01

new solutions and products

17:03

and we do therefore take an approach

17:05

where

17:06

roughly speaking we say the more risk

17:08

you take the more money we’ll put in and

17:11

if you collaborate because we’re a

17:12

global organization uh operating across

17:15

multiple geographies so if you get

17:17

together with your mate across the

17:18

border we will double the amount of

17:20

funding we give you so we’re trying to

17:22

encourage behavior whereby we can help

17:24

innovation flourish but also to at the

17:26

same time drive collaboration between

17:28

markets where that is

17:30

possible thank you and stefan is that

17:33

something that you’ve you’ve

17:35

had to try out

17:37

i think we have a similar approach in

17:40

the sense that we look at every file for

17:42

its own merits so if somebody comes to

17:44

group and requires either funding or

17:46

assistance or whatever we will look at

17:48

the file but it needs to have a

17:49

dimension that goes beyond the the

17:51

country that is submitting uh the file

17:54

there has to be some sort of group uh or

17:56

at least a number of geographies should

17:58

be

17:59

interested and then we will have a look

18:01

at it and judge the file on its own

18:02

merits and if it’s something that we

18:04

consider that would be useful for

18:06

multiple geographies then indeed we will

18:08

we will also support it be it

18:10

financially or by with resources

18:13

great

18:14

um thank you for your your thoughts on

18:17

on those various topics i’d like to just

18:19

spin the the conversation in a slightly

18:21

different direction now just to look at

18:23

the human elements of innovation

18:26

um my sense on this is that um

18:29

humans are necessary

18:31

to

18:32

innovation we we bring the creativity we

18:34

bring the risk taking that

18:36

entrepreneurial

18:37

drive and that ability to spot the the

18:40

random connections

18:42

and yet it seems to me

18:44

that

18:45

it’s often we humans that get in the way

18:48

of innovation and some of the the

18:50

characteristics that i i would say came

18:53

through in some of our east were in some

18:54

of our research were

18:56

a lack of willingness to be accountable

19:00

um often a lack of humility

19:02

um amongst uh those of us in the

19:04

innovation space and i’d certainly level

19:06

some of those criticisms of myself um i

19:10

wonder if i put the question to you what

19:11

is what does the perfect innovator look

19:13

like as a person what are the

19:14

characteristics and attributes that you

19:16

would look for

19:17

in senior members of your team

19:20

what would you describe um stephen

19:22

can i i know you’re looking for someone

19:24

so this is just a quick side advert

19:26

stephen is looking for great innovation

19:28

talent right now um

19:31

i suspect all the time this goes live uh

19:34

we would have found him or her

19:36

but when it comes to innovation um we

19:39

need to have people that uh

19:42

understand business first and foremost

19:43

this is business ultimately let’s not

19:45

forget that it’s not a game understand

19:47

the business um but have an open mind

19:50

in terms of challenging the status quo

19:52

because

19:53

as any business you know we’ve been

19:55

around for hundreds of years we’ve built

19:57

up processes and cultures over those

19:58

years that sometimes need to be

20:00

challenged and it needs to be challenged

20:02

in an open and transparent way and so

20:04

that person needs to be able to have the

20:05

energy to be able to challenge the

20:07

status quo they also need to bring a

20:10

good deal of humility with them um and

20:13

not because humility is good generally

20:15

but because when you’re talking to 55

20:17

different businesses about innovation

20:20

the last thing you want to do is go in

20:21

and say oh i know best about innovation

20:23

i’m going to tell you all about it you

20:24

just sit down and listen to me and then

20:26

we’ll be fine that doesn’t work and so

20:28

you need to build rapport with those

20:30

businesses and you need to get them to

20:31

do what you think they need to do with

20:34

them owning it because they are the

20:35

ultimate p l owners and so therefore a

20:37

great dose of humility will help in that

20:39

building relationships and then finally

20:41

i would say they need to be able to

20:42

build relationships and to influence

20:44

senior leaders right across the

20:46

organization um going back to the point

20:49

you made earlier dan about you know

20:51

there are expectations in organizations

20:52

we need to manage those we need to work

20:54

with them and try and break out of the

20:56

framework to try and achieve innovation

20:58

while still achieving the results that

21:00

innovate or head of innovation needs to

21:02

be someone that can stand up in front of

21:03

the ceo tell a great story convince them

21:06

this is worthwhile doing and get the

21:07

momentum and the energy going and so

21:09

there’s a human spirit there that needs

21:11

to be really alive and enthusiastic uh

21:13

to drive that forward so any candidates

21:15

you please uh email me later please yeah

21:18

do get in touch

21:20

stefan how about you what’s your what’s

21:21

your perfect innovator look like

21:24

uh i think i’m going to echo much of

21:26

what

21:27

stephen has said i don’t think that

21:28

there’s a sort of a

21:30

proven success

21:32

formula for what is a good uh

21:34

innovator so all the things steven said

21:36

and perhaps one additional element which

21:38

is

21:39

uh

21:40

being able to be very very patient and

21:43

that

21:44

especially in an insurance environment

21:46

you’re coming into an environment into

21:48

businesses that have existed for

21:49

hundreds of years

21:50

um so it this is not the kind of uh

21:53

environment that

21:55

appreciates the sort of shock and awe

21:57

approach that that some of these people

21:58

uh would bring so you need to be able to

22:01

to to have a lot of patience and to see

22:04

things evolve gradually

22:06

um resilience right

22:09

that’s uh one of the the primary um

22:11

attributes

22:13

very good well listen i think we’re

22:14

going to be drawing our conversation to

22:16

a close but what i wanted to do just as

22:18

a last thing is just throw throw the

22:21

throw the the mic back to each of you

22:23

and turn stephen i’ll start with you

22:25

maybe just any final comments thoughts

22:27

or or um

22:29

can i cheer on messages for the

22:31

innovation community around the world as

22:33

we um as we connect virtually in this

22:36

insurgent connect

22:37

um i think the need for innovation now

22:40

is greater than it ever was before if

22:42

you look at what’s happening in the

22:43

world around us not just coronavirus but

22:45

the economic change

22:46

the digital transformation that’s

22:48

happening we’re all being asked to uh to

22:51

work in different ways to work faster

22:53

quicker smarter cheaper

22:55

and actually the only way to do that in

22:57

a way that is going to benefit everybody

22:58

is to innovate and even innovate

23:01

consistently and consistently well and

23:03

so that’s a real challenge for all

23:04

organizations

23:06

you may be sitting out there thinking

23:07

like yes but innovation is great at a

23:09

conference but when i get back into my

23:10

business nobody wants to do it they all

23:12

want to focus on running the p l day to

23:14

day what i would say to you is is have

23:16

faith keep persisting keep getting help

23:19

from the outside in if you can’t get the

23:21

the traction into internally and then

23:23

find those stakeholders internally who

23:25

are enthusiastic about change and

23:27

innovation and use that to build a steam

23:29

of steam of energy to then really drive

23:31

change across your organization it will

23:33

happen it’s just a matter of when thank

23:36

you stephen and how about you stephanie

23:37

last message

23:39

for our audience today

23:41

i think there’s never been a greater

23:43

time to uh to do innovation leaders

23:45

there’s never been so much change but

23:47

also never been so much willingness to

23:49

change whether that’s now been driven by

23:50

the environment or by other

23:52

sort of even the things like the the

23:54

pandemic has pushed forward a number of

23:56

things that we mentioned

23:58

like daily working just being a simple

24:00

example but still creating a flexibility

24:02

and adaptability that we’ve seen people

24:04

enjoying and actually people thriving on

24:06

it so i think if you want to if you want

24:08

to be in this space i think it’s the

24:09

best of times to be in this space i

24:11

think there’s never been an openness and

24:13

a willingness to embrace it uh

24:15

more than today so

24:17

yeah if you want to do it go for it just

24:19

you know be entrepreneurial take the

24:21

chance and and and eat also again be

24:24

patient uh but but resilient

24:27

thank you stefan and thank you steven

24:29

both um

24:30

a fantastic encouragements for the

24:32

community out there and yeah i just echo

24:34

that there’s some really exciting stuff

24:36

going on uh right now we’re in the in

24:38

the process at 90 of pulling together

24:40

our idea pulse report which is a a state

24:42

of innovation in insurance so we’re

24:44

looking at the ideas and insurance and

24:46

it’s some really exciting stuff coming

24:48

through

24:49

um

24:51

so my thanks to to you stephen thank you

24:54

for joining from general ali and and

24:55

stephane thank you for joining from a gs

24:57

really appreciate your wisdom the time

24:59

you’ve put in today

25:00

thank you to the audience uh for your

25:02

time attention please do feel free to

25:04

reach out to any of us through linkedin

25:06

in follow-up to listen enjoy the rest of

25:09

intro tech connect goodbye

25:12

thank you

25:13

thank you

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